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Post by jessicapollard on Dec 17, 2013 0:37:17 GMT
I'm about to go super-cynic up in here. I feel like marriage itself has the power, and it's a dangerous one. Yes, it's self imposed but in this situation it seems to be more of an expectation than a willing thing. Jack fears breaking his marriage despite his unhappiness and instead sneaks around. When supposing her future with Jack, the narrator also relies on marriage and the obstacles it creates. It's shown to be a devastating force. It turns her "I love Jack..." something more ominous. Marriage is the driving force behind the story and the title seems to speak to this. "No One's a Mystery" seems to say that no one is surprised to see a man cheat on his wife in secret for fear of breaking a marriage, and that many would expect an 18 year old girl to dream of marriage. It shapes the thoughts and actions of the characters.
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Post by austinellerbruch on Dec 17, 2013 0:44:41 GMT
I don't think that any of the characters hold any power, and that they are instead slaves to the power of the passions. The narrator is indulged in a sort of a fairytale-princess dynamic, believing that Jack is her night in shining armor whom she is destined to spend her life with. Jack's "interest" in the narrator seems purely for the purpose of fulfilling his sexual interests, and he knows that in reality that their relationship will conclude within a short time. This story shows that we, as humans, are slaves of the passionate feelings that drive us, and that mindless indulgence into these feelings leaves our lives empty and without worth.
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Kasey
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Post by Kasey on Dec 17, 2013 0:54:07 GMT
The reader has the power, because the reader is the one who determines the tone of how characters interact with each other. This is proven by our current discussion, where some of us rep for the man being stronger, and some of us rep for the woman, depending on how we read the story.
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Post by hannahlewman on Dec 17, 2013 1:53:06 GMT
Maybe my brain is permanently twisted from reading too much Fitzgerald (actually, that's not even a maybe), but if my old sport Scott taught me anything, it's that the one who controls the narrative controls the power dynamic. Though the girl is controlling the narrative, I don't think the 18-year old version of her is the most powerful person in the whole exchange, in fact, she may be the least powerful (just look at the fact that Jack drives the car, Jack has a name, and Jack pushes her head down). But the girl is narrating in past tense, meaning that the more mature, older, reflective version of her has the most power. She is in control of the narrative, which is symbolic of being in control of her life. I find this to be very optimistic. Though she was naive and weak as an 18-year old, the girl eventually gains power through unknown means and takes control of the narrative. This says that there is hope for people, specifically women in this case, who seek liberation from the people, or in this case men, who control their lives.
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Post by mattagritelley on Dec 17, 2013 2:16:18 GMT
The power dynamic in "No One's a Mystery" can be examined through three driving forces: strength, limitation and reality. Starting at the most basic level, Jack clearly appears to be physically superior to the narrator. Tallent writes, "He pushed me down onto the dirty floor of the pickup and kept one hand on my head while I inhaled the musk of his cigarettes in the dashboard ashtray" (246). His sheer overpowering strength gives the illusion that he holds the power in their relationship. This may be true on a cursory level, but looking deeper into the implicit controlling forces, we see that Jack is not as dominating as his strength.
Upon the introduction of Jack's wife, Tallent illustrates another factor in the power dynamic: the limitations and constraints his wife adds to his relationship with the narrator. The narrator nervously utters, "'She'll see your lips move, Jack. She'll know you're talking to someone.'"(246). The wife provides a constraint that guides Jack's actions, causing him to carry out his relationship in secrecy. This constraint is a large influence on the power dynamic in the novel, for the wife indirectly determines the actions Jack takes. Although she is ignorant of her own influence on this dynamic, she nonetheless provides the most substantial limitation to Jack's power.
Furthermore, the narrator holds a power that is out of her control. This power is reality, which manifests itself in Jack's brain and instills a sense of hopelessness in his existence. Jack coldly adds, "'In two years you'll write, 'I wonder what that old guy's name was, the one with the curly hair and the filthy dirty pickup truck and time on his hands" (247). Conversely, the narrator says, "'In two years I'll write, 'Jack should be home by now. Little Jack is hungry for his supper. He said his first word today besides "Mama and "Papa"'"(247). The disparity between the two comments shows how Jack is haunted by the reality that the narrator is going to grow and forget him entirely. He, on the other hand, will live the remainder of his life bearing memories of the relationship. This is very influential on the power dynamic between Jack and the narrator and how Jack views his time spent with her.
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Post by abbylyons on Dec 17, 2013 2:22:59 GMT
This is not a contest between two girls over a boyfriend. Rather, this is about one woman trying to steal another woman’s husband. On one side of the power dynamic is the 18-year-old narrator, who is ruthlessly working to induce Jack to break his commitment to his wife and abandon her. She uses her youth and sexuality to attempt to win the prize. On the other side of the power dynamic is the wife. She drives a Cadillac, which tells us that she has money and that she is probably already in her thirties. The wife may not know that she is in a contest, but her power is her wealth. She drives the speed limit, which in Wyoming shows a high degree of self-discipline and adherence to rules. She is certainly the more empathetic figure, and in the end she is the one most likely to prevail because Jack values her financial support. That is why he has so much “time on his hands” (247), but he doesn’t have control of the money or he would have bought himself something better than an old pickup truck. Jack knows very well that the narrator will not support him the way his wife does.
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Post by rubyking on Dec 17, 2013 2:31:21 GMT
I like Austin's response. While I don't see any true altruistic feelings of love here, love isn't necessarily about holding power, rather surrendering those dominant tendencies to a dulcet vulnerability. I don't read the man as using this girl 100 percent for sexual exploration, which is where Kasey's response also holds extreme value. There's a sadness about his demeanor, because he's knows that this "relationship" isn't headed anywhere, but it's comforting for him to behold this fresh presence who looks at him with all the romantic optimism in the world, something he obviously doesn't get from his marriage. And the girl, she might be surrendering her power because she thinks she loves him, and maybe this is one of the only constant pleasures she has in her life. If we think about it, if she's laying with a married man in his dirty truck, what is her family situation like? She could be surrendering her power to grow up?
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Post by yongkim on Dec 17, 2013 2:41:55 GMT
It is quite evident that Jack possesses the physical power when he pushes the girl into hiding below the dashboard in order to hide from his wife. However, I believe the narrator has the power in other aspects of their relationship. Jack makes it seem as if the girl is in control of their relationship when he states, " In a year you'll write, 'I wonder what I ever really saw in Jack. I wonder why I spent so many days just riding in his pickup..." (247). Jack speaks as if he will continue to love her, but the ultimate demise of their love relationship will be due to the narrator falling out of love with him. The girl constantly reinforces the idea that she will continue to love him; however, Jack continually says she will not love him in the future. When Jack gives her the diary in the beginning of the story, it is a gift to the narrator that expresses his desire to continue their relationship.
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amychen
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“But the wild things cried, “Oh please don’t go—we’ll eat you up—we love you so!”
Posts: 47
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Post by amychen on Dec 17, 2013 2:43:29 GMT
I touched on this topic a bit in my other post:
"While in typical romantic young adult literature, the focus is on narration and the emotions of the narrator, our narrator interjects little to no personal opinion through narration, excluding dialogue. By taking out the romanticized narration typically found in the genre, focusing on the facts of the situation (i.e. Jack's poor treatment of the narrator, the narrator's naive responses, and Jack's awareness of the relationship's impermanence), Tallent points out the genre's weaknesses, humanizing Jack by focusing on his back-story and self-pity---"I wonder what I ever really saw in Jack...It's true he taught me something about sex. It's true there wasn't ever much else to do in Cheyenne" (247)---while simultaneously pointing out the narrator's seemingly conscious ignorance---she ignores Jack's statement, "It must have been a fast divorce" (247)---which Jack takes full advantage of, and possibly manipulates by trying to get her to pity him."
In other words, Jack pities himself for his age and situation and the narrator wants to believe in a happy ending, so Jack takes advantage of her. His self-pity, genuine or not, reinforces the narrator's infatuation with Jack by pushing her to comfort him with her romantic fantasy. Although some believe Jack's wife holds the most power in the situation, I'd like to dance with that---Jack doesn't seem to care much for the narrator and doesn't seem interested in a long term relationship. His explanations of the narrator's future focus on the narrator's youth---"I wonder what that old guy's name was, the one with the curly hair and the filthy dirty pickup truck and time on his hands"---and unrelated to Jack's wife. Both characters do things to avoid getting caught by his wife, but the actions reflect Jack and the narrator's relationship---Jack's outright disrespect for the narrator and the narrator's acceptance of his mistreatment---more than their relationship to Jack's wife. The two characters trap themselves in the narrator's fantasy---the narrator, in an effort to grow up and start a family, and Jack, to try to feel young again. The actions they take as a result of this---Jack pushing down the narrator's head out of paranoia, the narrator ignoring this treatment (assuming it will end when they get married and have Little Jack)---are merely reflected of the unhealthy interdependence of the two.
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rishi
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Post by rishi on Dec 17, 2013 3:12:43 GMT
I completely agree with Jessie in that the immaterial aspects of the story have the most power. At first glance, it may seem like Jack has physical power and the narrator has the power of first-person perspective, but, ultimately, the forces driving these characters are incorporeal forces such as circumstance and human nature. Jack's marriage plays a dominant role in his cynicism towards the thought of spending his life with his mistress. He clearly enjoys the thought of being with his mistress but knows that he realistically cannot. Commenting on the hypothetical diary entries, Jack explains, "I like yours...but I believe mine" (Tallent 247). Jack's circumstances drive him to be realistic about his infidelity. Human nature also has power over Jack and his mistress because it contributes to one of the conflicts in the story: the disagreement over the future of Jack's relationship with his mistress. Jack is obviously much older than the unnamed woman in his truck, and it is only fitting that the older Jack is more practical about his situation. Meanwhile, his youthful mistress seems to be infatuated with the idea of love, refusing to consider the realistic possibility of an end to her relationship with Jack. We can see this same type of infatuation in Shakespeare's Romeo and Juliet. Human nature, or the disparity in thought due to the age gap between Jack and his mistress, has power over the way the characters feel about each other and how they expect to live in the future.
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Post by garygates on Dec 17, 2013 3:38:05 GMT
I would like to argue that neither the narrator nor Jack holds the power in their relationship. While I believe that in many ways I could make the point that societal norms and expectations hold the true power in the relationship, as we have come to expect the young girl's power to reside in her innocence and optimism and the power of the older and cheating man to reside in his (depending on what you would like to call it) pessimism or realism, I would like to play with the idea that the power resides in Jack's wife. Whether she knows it or not, Jack's wife has an incredibly strong influence on the power dynamics between Jack and the narrator.
Jack will either be caught cheating by his wife or he will not. There is no grey area in between these two points. Either way, however, Jack's marriage is still in his wife's hands. She may or may not want to divorce him if she finds out that he is cheating, and may or may not decide to divorce him anyways, due to other problems possibly present in their relationship. As we see from Jack's actions in the car with the narrator, Jack is still worried that his wife will discover him cheating, and this fear causes this actions, as told by the narrator: "He pushed me down onto the dirty floor of the pickup and kept one hand on my head" (246). It does not seem like either party, the narrator or Jack, is in disagreement about hiding from Jack's wife, thus, although Jack does in fact illustrate in some interpretations a physical dominance by pushing the narrator's head down out of sight, both parties seem happy to comply to the idea of secrecy from Jack's wife.
The wife's power continues contributing to the actions of the two in the car as the story goes on. Firstly, Jack admits that his wife keeping her car lights on in daytime is one of her habits that bothers him to no end. In fact, he "can't think of a single habit in a woman that irritates [him] more than that" (246). This habit and probably a cumulation of all things that bother Jack about his wife have likely had a great effect on his marital affairs, once again demonstrating Jack's wife cause and effect role in Jack's cheating with the narrator. And secondly, It is likely that Jack's wife has a strong effect on his "pessimistic" outlook on life. While the narrator is not engaged in a relationship and sees herself marrying Jack and creating a family with him in the future, Jack is foresees the narrator having left him and even forgotten about him within the next two years. As most cheating marriages end, due to interaction with his current wife, Jack will likely never have a long lasting relationship with the narrator. He cares about his wife enough, it seems, so that if she is to catch and to divorce him, and I don't believe, nor do I think Jack believes, that he will end up with the woman with whom he cheated on his wife. And if he does in fact care enough about his wife and his current relationship with this wife, as I think he does, this cheating on his wife with the narrator will be temporary and replaced with another affair or a change in heart. Overall, the wife has quite possibly the larges power roll in the relatioship between Jack and the narrator.
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Post by allegra on Dec 17, 2013 3:51:38 GMT
mmmkay ya'll, there are a number of different things that suggest a power dynamic-y type thing is at play (other than the fact that Mr Parris told us to write about the dynamics). Right off the bat the first thing I noticed that was strange was their age difference: this already puts the narrator at a disadvantage because it appears she is at odds with a more experienced partner. She is only seventeen and yet she is with a man who is married and with children. He believes she is childish and from the beginning gives her a diary in some kind of acknowledgement at her young age. She trusts him, like, bunches, considering she doesn't do anything when he pushes her down except note the bleached parts of his jeans in the crotch and knees, like she finds his penis some kind of holy and divine object. He, of course, knows otherwise- his car is dirty on the inside... "some kid will get hurt"... you see, she's going to get hurt and Jack knows it. And tbh he's an asshole.
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Post by emwolfram on Dec 17, 2013 3:53:26 GMT
Only Jack has the power to give the narrator what she dreams of. He alone can leave his wife and start a life with the young girl. All the wishing and hoping in the world won't change the circumstances. Jack is the one who decides which journal becomes a reality. Judging by his harsh and pessimistic words he has already made his choice. I find it interesting so many people feel the wife holds the power... I thinking if that was the case her husband would not be screwing an 18 year-old girl behind her back. The wife does not have a say or a voice in anything that is occurring during this story therefore she wields no power. This young narrator is making a fatal but common mistake, she is putting her hopes and dreams in the hands of another person. The life she wants is not something she can choose, it can only be given to her by Jack. That is not a relationship where power is equally held. This might be the most simple answer but I think it is also the best answer.
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Post by davidqin on Dec 17, 2013 4:06:32 GMT
I find the wife's power in "No One's a Mystery" quite intriguing. Jack's wife exerts a distant, but still very real influence on both Jack and the girl. Even the girl knows all about the wife's omnipresence, like how "She'll see your lips move, Jack. She'll know you're talking to someone" (246), and of course the wife must have a strong grip on Jack. I agree with Kevin in that the wife drives the plot of the entire story, causing Jack to push the girl down onto the floor of the truck and causing them to eventually talk about their respective versions of the future.
At an initial glance, Jack holds much of the power over the narrator. He's physically in control over the girl as he pushes her down and out of sight. He adopts a condescending tone later on, saying "'You even sound like a kid. You can get back into the seat now, if you want" (246). Here, Jack clearly has a degree of power over the girl. Jack also knows himself better than the girl, and he holds the advantage of knowing about the future of their relationship. Since he obviously knows something the girl doesn't (perhaps his current and future tendency to transgress), his vision of the future is self-deprecating and decidedly negative; it is, in his words, the "kind of a bittersweet smell, if you want to know the truth" (247). His sense of regret erodes his power in the present as it hints at his resignation to his moral flaws.
This leads into the power the girl holds over Jack. She holds the power of feminine allure over him, at least for now, in the same way she's attracted to him. The girl's consistent optimism also charms Jack, holding him in its thrall. Even though she is pushed down in the truck by Jack (and by extension, the wife), she holds a tremendous power over Jack's future. Her optimistic version of the future clashes with Jack's, and has the potential to change Jack for the better so he may realize the happier future. The narrator's compassion and kindness are a kind of hidden power that can possibly overcome the raw physical influence of Jack and his wife. This way, this girl could possibly hold the greatest power over the other two figures due to her strong belief in a happier future for Jack.
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Post by natalieskowlund on Dec 17, 2013 4:20:10 GMT
While the general consensus seems to be that Jack has the most power, I don't think power in this story is so much a function of who the characters are as why they are the way they are. I think the story is less about definitive dominance and more about the struggle of reconciling conflicting ideologies. The girl obviously hopes for an ideal life, where everything works out as it was meant to. Jack, on the other hand, has more experience under his belt, and thus a more realistic--if cynical--view of the way things will pan out in the end. While the girl enthusiastically jumps to conclusions, Jack is reluctant to give in to her youthful dreams, constantly insisting that things will not change for the better anytime soon. And yet, both viewpoints seem too extreme to ultimately hold the power. In a sense, the story is a statement not just about the correlation between life outlook and age, but about which vision of reality can be trusted. I think we are inclined to assume that Jack is more accurate in his understanding of reality because he has lived longer than the girl, but I think it is more than possible that both the girl and Jack hold immensely flawed understandings of the way the world works. Both seem like extremists, when reality is probably more of a gray area than one thing over another. The story is a power struggle between two different world views, and as Postmodernists would say, neither can dominate because the truth will always remain subjective, completely depending on individual interpretation. So is the dreamer or the cynic more keenly aware of reality? It's a good question, and one that the story certainly poses...but it leaves the answer up to the reader.
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